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From: Lars Boegild Thomsen <lth@reclaim-your-privacy.com>
To: tor-talk@lists.torproject.org
Date: Sun, 09 Nov 2014 17:03:34 +0800
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Subject: Re: [tor-talk] Cloak Tor Router
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On Sunday 02 November 2014 11:52:48 Aymeric Vitte wrote:
> > Yeah I guess we are less "marketing oriented" perhaps even to a fau=
lt.  Anonabox definitely kicked up more interest than Cloak have done s=
o far.
> I don't know how anonabox did to attract so many people so quickly, I=
=20
> guess they have some contacts in the press and blogs, this campaign w=
as=20
> something like an organized "gang" attack, unfortunatley this might h=
ave=20
> rendered people skeptical now for your campaign.

And he just managed - sort of - to do it again.  This time he has resur=
faced in Indiegogo claiming to use PORTAL (the OpenWrt version hasn't b=
een updated for 2 years so I am not sure why he think that will make it=
 better).

> > The enclosure design has not been finalized but we do have an idea =
and a designer working on it and Adrian have just changed the image to =
show the first rendering.  Do check it out if you feel like it - I thin=
k the "stealth look'n'feel) is quite cool.  Size wise it will be smalle=
r than a TP-Link MR3020.
> Maybe you should highlight it more in the presentation, so potential=20=

> backers see it right away, as well as a simple drawing showing how to=
=20
> connect to the box easily, suggestions...

There is a new 3D rendering which will be uploaded today.

> >> And probably you know already the drawdbacks of such approach,
> > I am aware of some but I am also quite sure there are some I haven'=
t considered, so input is appreciated.
> > I think the hardest part is to make non-technical users aware that =
a Tor router can only do so much.  Their behavior using such a router i=
s just as important (or more).

I think the only approach is proper documentation.

> > The trick is to find a balance and I guess that is what I personall=
y hope to find by discussing it here.  If a general consensus over a re=
asonable list of ports that are routed through Tor could be reached tha=
t would be great.
> > HTTPS you say.  What about for example XMPP, IMAP etc?
> The balance is not easy to find I think, as everybody knows anonymizi=
ng=20
> you wrongly will lead to the contrary.
> The rule could be "everything that is using SSL", if not the exit nod=
es=20
> can MITM you

Problem is that would require protocol inspection and that is probably =
a bit outside the real of possibility for a processor of the size we im=
agine in the Cloak.  I think the best approach is to close everything b=
y default and then have a whitelist of well defined ports that is well =
documented - including the possible dangers.

> >> Potential applications (among tons of possible ones) see the links=

> >> below: node-Tor (Cloak with a much smaller package), Peersm
> >> clients/bridges [1] (permanent background processes in the box, li=
ke
> >> bittorrent clients in ISP boxes), torrent-live (find/block/track
> >> monitoring spies + maintain a real time blocklist bittorrent clien=
t)
> > My personal expertise is networking and embedded Linux and I would =
be happy to run some tests on this and/or participate in any projects g=
etting something like this going.
> Interesting, that's cool that you did consider it and shows that the=20=

> project is not only about packaging Tor is some small hw, I don't kno=
w=20
> with what apps you did test it but probably some optimization can be=20=

> made for the gc issues, and the whole nodejs might not be required, I=
=20
> will contact you off the list to see what can be done (if you have ti=
me=20
> of course, probably busy by the campaign right now)

Let's move that one off-list, but I'll be happy to discuss any ideas yo=
u might have.

=2D-=20
Lars Boegild Thomsen
https://reclaim-your-privacy.com
Jabber/XMPP: lth@reclaim-your-privacy.com
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