Delivery-Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2015 20:30:39 -0500
Return-Path: <tor-talk-bounces@lists.torproject.org>
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on moria.seul.org
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.1 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED,
	DKIM_SIGNED,FREEMAIL_FROM,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED,T_DKIM_INVALID,T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD,
	URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=ham version=3.3.1
X-Original-To: archiver@seul.org
Delivered-To: archiver@seul.org
Received: from eugeni.torproject.org (eugeni.torproject.org [38.229.72.13])
	(using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits))
	(No client certificate requested)
	by khazad-dum.seul.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 359311E0ABC
	for <archiver@seul.org>; Wed,  4 Mar 2015 20:30:37 -0500 (EST)
Received: from eugeni.torproject.org (localhost [127.0.0.1])
	by eugeni.torproject.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA046357F9;
	Thu,  5 Mar 2015 01:30:32 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])
 by eugeni.torproject.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E05CC357F5
 for <tor-talk@lists.torproject.org>; Thu,  5 Mar 2015 01:30:28 +0000 (UTC)
X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at 
Received: from eugeni.torproject.org ([127.0.0.1])
 by localhost (eugeni.torproject.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024)
 with ESMTP id Za2ITqRF6Sr0 for <tor-talk@lists.torproject.org>;
 Thu,  5 Mar 2015 01:30:28 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from mail-qc0-x229.google.com (mail-qc0-x229.google.com
 [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c01::229])
 (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits))
 (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com",
 Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (not verified))
 by eugeni.torproject.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B41DE357EE
 for <tor-talk@lists.torproject.org>; Thu,  5 Mar 2015 01:30:28 +0000 (UTC)
Received: by qcwb13 with SMTP id b13so3058703qcw.12
 for <tor-talk@lists.torproject.org>; Wed, 04 Mar 2015 17:30:26 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113;
 h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:references:mime-version
 :content-type:content-transfer-encoding;
 bh=Bax3v303khUvpT+w+TSkiQONQEl2R7pocdnFJZd8GTg=;
 b=SfYT+VVqmN9PuI2Y9UxDNO3bAE4r/DAReE6IISvdQORk6Vt9z5Y8pEUR/zW+if62BH
 GDWNw43VgpQf3WTSJ8+sZta2048POJ4oGu32jIdLbq7L42jLBnXm/jeQ3unfQkRtU4Ip
 shG+F9PsVKxmeGb6zAf4lxOtY1vFexXPegI/kvdWZ7KFp4O8NxPJR7zNOz+KfnpK6mhh
 jmVRIo6rsUuZ0Js9YsN6+0JzaVi/CwzZ2rAOhhfrj/j2rcw6ypJS/wvsTCuMCHmw10c/
 sD+3MHPX2AEUnldpfjuiGrl9nZjfRb2sYPuO6AhBfHUzWeIkFHa6qNQa7RcjXOQoV959
 SHRg==
X-Received: by 10.55.20.8 with SMTP id e8mr12929997qkh.37.1425519026386;
 Wed, 04 Mar 2015 17:30:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: from localhost (host208.190-229-66.telecom.net.ar. [190.229.66.208])
 by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id
 y8sm3161150qal.14.2015.03.04.17.30.25
 for <tor-talk@lists.torproject.org>
 (version=TLSv1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128);
 Wed, 04 Mar 2015 17:30:25 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <54f7b1b1.0858e00a.0605.4276@mx.google.com>
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2015 22:33:28 -0300
From: Juan <juan.g71@gmail.com>
To: tor-talk@lists.torproject.org
In-Reply-To: <N1-kXaumK6rEQ@Safe-mail.net>
References: <N1-kXaumK6rEQ@Safe-mail.net>
X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.7.10 (GTK+ 2.24.10; i486-slitaz-linux-gnu)
Mime-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [tor-talk] New Tor project idea for internet comments
X-BeenThere: tor-talk@lists.torproject.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
Reply-To: tor-talk@lists.torproject.org
List-Id: "all discussion about theory, design,
 and development of Onion Routing" <tor-talk.lists.torproject.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/tor-talk>, 
 <mailto:tor-talk-request@lists.torproject.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://lists.torproject.org/pipermail/tor-talk/>
List-Post: <mailto:tor-talk@lists.torproject.org>
List-Help: <mailto:tor-talk-request@lists.torproject.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-talk>, 
 <mailto:tor-talk-request@lists.torproject.org?subject=subscribe>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Errors-To: tor-talk-bounces@lists.torproject.org
Sender: "tor-talk" <tor-talk-bounces@lists.torproject.org>

On Wed, 4 Mar 2015 15:33:28 -0500
"Lee Malek" <leemalek@Safe-mail.net> wrote:

> 99% of censorship happens on blog comments. This kind of project
> would help to force an open dialog.


	Yes it is a good idea.  As a matter of fact I vaguely remember
	a browser addon that would let people do exactly that : you
	could add comments to websites and the comments were not stored
	on the site but on...a different server run by the people who
	created the addon? I never really investigated it. 

	To make it 'censorship resistent' the comments would have to be
	stored in a freenet-like database. Actually, all you need is a 
	browser plugin that can store content in freenet. You don't
	need tor. 



> 
> If we aren't going on the offensive against censorship we will lose
> eventually. The power is in the hands of those who control the
> message. And those who control the media control the message. This
> would allow us to break through the shit and get a counter-message
> out right on their own websites.
> 
> There is a way to accomplish this.
> 
> Also, we need to start thinking about message control, not just
> governments blocking certain sites. The elites fear the internet and
> anonymity because of the possibility of losing control of the
> message/ the dialog ,whatever you want to call it.
> 
> Putting the message in the hands of the people is the best thing that
> could ever happen for US and the worst thing for them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -------- Original Message --------
> From: Juan <juan.g71@gmail.com>
> Apparently from: tor-talk-bounces@lists.torproject.org
> To: tor-talk@lists.torproject.org
> Subject: Re: [tor-talk] New Tor project idea for internet comments
> Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2015 17:26:32 -0300
> 
> > On Wed, 4 Mar 2015 14:11:33 -0500
> > "Lee Malek" <leemalek@Safe-mail.net> wrote:
> > 
> > > This has nothing to do with people censoring tor users and
> > > everything to do with normal blogs censoring normal users because
> > > they don't like their comments. I am thinking mainly of the USA
> > > here. This will be a problem as time progresses.
> > 
> > 
> > 	Don't bother. The party line here is to 'fight' for
> > 'freedom' in places where the american imperialist military has
> > problems gathering 'intelligence'. 
> > 
> > 	Prime example : A country like china is firewalled  so the 
> > 	pentagon can't spy on the chinese internet directly. Hence,
> > 	tor. 
> > 
> > 	And of course, in a place like the US you're going to find
> > 	extensive censorship in 'public' and 'private' websites.
> > Hell that is American Freedom! In a united state people should be
> > 	free to censor any kind of disent. 
> > 
> > 
> > > 
> > > This allows sharing of information directly on news sites, safely
> > > and anonymously, completely circumventing their censoring of other
> > > political views. How is this not the place for something like
> > > this?
> > > 
> > > 
> > > -------- Original Message --------
> > > From: michael ball <michaelballriseup@gmail.com>
> > > Apparently from: tor-talk-bounces@lists.torproject.org
> > > To: tor-talk@lists.torproject.org
> > > Subject: Re: [tor-talk] New Tor project idea for internet comments
> > > Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2015 11:39:05 -0700
> > > 
> > > > This isn't technically feasible-- for example, censored users in
> > > > countries with slow Internet speeds (Iran, Cuba, Syria) would be
> > > > unable to connect to the network by being forced to relay
> > > > connections if they install the browser plugin. The Tor network
> > > > relies on volunteers who have the ability to quickly and safely
> > > > relay traffic to do so, and users who do not have those
> > > > abilities are not at a disadvantage.
> > > > 
> > > > Tor developers, community members and volunteers could better
> > > > spend the time creating this system for something that yields
> > > > more results, like actually encouraging the websites who censor
> > > > Tor users to not do so-- they should rather use a CAPTCHA
> > > > system or another form of human verification (that does not
> > > > break anonymity).
> > > > 
> > > > > So many news website block comments they dont like these days.
> > > > 
> > > > This isn't something new or exclusive to Tor users. Anyone who
> > > > creates a website with a comment system can censor and prune the
> > > > comments they don't agree with. I do agree, a separate comment
> > > > system would be great at fighting the censorship by websites,
> > > > but it isn't something the Tor developers should focus on.
> > > > 
> > > > Good idea, but not exactly the right place. Thanks for the
> > > > idea, and welcome to the Tor mailing list!
> > > > -- 
> > > > tor-talk mailing list - tor-talk@lists.torproject.org
> > > > To unsubscribe or change other settings go to
> > > > https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-talk
> > 
> > -- 
> > tor-talk mailing list - tor-talk@lists.torproject.org
> > To unsubscribe or change other settings go to
> > https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-talk

-- 
tor-talk mailing list - tor-talk@lists.torproject.org
To unsubscribe or change other settings go to
https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-talk

